1: AI with Heart: Celia Jones on Values, Discernment, and Human-Centered Communication
Kinwise Conversations Episode 1 · Hit play or read the transcript below
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Lydia Kumar: Welcome to Kinwise Conversations, where we explore what it means to integrate AI into our work and lives with care, clarity, and creativity. Each episode we talk with everyday leaders navigating these powerful tools, balancing innovation with intention and technology with humanity. I'm your host, Lydia Kumar.
Today I'm so delighted to introduce our very first guest, Celia Jones. Celia is a seasoned communications professional with a wonderfully creative spirit and a deep seated commitment to service, particularly within nonprofit and faith-based spaces. In our conversation, Celia shares her personal journey with AI from an initial curiosity mixed with a little healthy apprehension to discovering how these tools can be powerful partners in a demanding communications role.
We'll hear about how she's leveraging AI to understand audience, streamline her work in a new industry, and even act as a thought partner that helps her refine her own thinking and writing. Celia offers such a grounded and human perspective on finding the balance between AI's efficiency and the irreplaceable value of human connection, discernment, and our unique intuition.
It's a conversation about enhancing our humanity even as we embrace new technologies.
Lydia Kumar: Celia, I am so happy to have you on the podcast today. And, um, I've known you for a long time, but our listeners do not know you. And so I wanna start out just by having you introduce yourself, talk about, um, what you love, where your path has taken you, and what your work life is like.
Celia Jones: Okay. I'm so excited to be here. This is Baby's first podcast that I've ever been recorded on, so, and it's so fun to get to do it with you because we talk a lot actually. You're such an intentional friend, and so we spend a lot of time on the phone together, and so it's fun to make it official and put it out in the world because we've been talking a lot about AI.
So I'm excited to be here and I hope that we can. Together, sort of spark some fun conversation. My name is Celia Jones and I am a professional communicator. So no pressure, no pressure to communicate well here, but, um,
Lydia Kumar: No, maybe more.
Celia Jones: Yeah, it's been a long time. Maybe more like 15 because we met in college. But yeah, so just set the stage about who I am. I grew up really rural, uh, in Southern Virginia, south Central to be specific. And so I grew up on a farm outside of a one stoplight town.
Um, I love to read. Growing up I was really curious and creative. I remember I would just draw and draw and draw. And I have this very specific memory that I feel like relates to our conversation, my dad built us a wood swing, uh, in an oak tree. First of all, we had a banging backyard as as kids. It was great. Um, but he put up this wood swing for us and I remember being in this wood swing and it overlooks like farmland, right? And I remember I had, you know, I think reading as a child gave me sort of a window to the world. I think we would agree on that. We both love to read and I just remember like thinking about my life and the future and be like, there's just so much in the world. For me to see and do and experience, and it's kind of scary. So, but, but there was like, so I feel like I had this immense like curiosity about life and the world and I wanted to express myself and be a part of it, but also, you know, I was in this very wonderful childhood bubble and I was like, man, I don't know if I wanna leave this, this great place. But I think ultimately the curiosity went out, right? So I loved being creative. I grew up in a community of faith. Uh, I grew up in the Christian faith and that sort of informed my decisions going forward. But I think as we'll talk about in this podcast, I also, oh, I have, I live on a street with motorcycles, so they're one a motorcycle. But, um, but as I grew up, I also have anxiety. So that sort of ties into this like duality of like, I'm really curious about the world also, the world is scary. So. When I was looking at colleges, we ended up at the same college. We both went to Bluefield College. Shout out, go Rams, and um. I was curious about, they had a program called Graphic Communications, which to me, I loved art and this felt like a practical way to marry art and communications work. And I literally had taken no design classes in high school. So I just sort of bet on, I hope this is nice. Bluefield is a Baptist, a Virginia Baptist College now University.1 Um, but it felt. It felt like a protected space and it felt like, I'm still leaving home, but I'm still in this safe. It felt like a home. I don't know how you felt when you went to Bluefield, but for me I was like, oh, this feels like an adventure, but a safe one.
I still felt called to ministry spaces. So that kind of led to my career, which has been. Basically 10 years of working as a communicator within faith spaces. So I was seven years as a director of communications for a church in Roanoke, and then I spent almost four years as a marketing and communications manager for a denominational ministry. So a lot of intergenerational communications work. How do we bridge communication gaps? And also I spent a lot of time as sort of a jack of all trades, a generalist in communications, and I was doing a lot of, you know, my work was a mile wide and an inch deep, so to speak. So, um, that sort of led me that in my curiosity about. New experiences, I guess, led me to the work that I've been doing for about six months, which is I serve as communications manager at Life Spire of Virginia and Life Spire is a nonprofit organization and they own and operate life plan communities, which is, uh, senior living term, but it's com I'm, I'm learning all the terms in this job. Uh, but they operate, they're also called. CCRC. So continuing care retirement communities, and it's essentially a space where we provide individuals with access to care at the level at which they need it, but also it's within a faith-based community with a focus on. Uh, the expression of faith, but also wellness and community. So, um, yeah, so that's a little bit about where me and how I landed up here, and I probably talk too much, so sorry.
Lydia Kumar: When you were sharing your stories, I was thinking a lot about this. Uh, you, you talked about this curiosity and safety and how those things kind of both exist within you, and you're very curious, but you're also like, Ooh, what, what's out there? And. When I think about generative AI and the way people respond to this new technology, I feel like people have a lot of this curiosity, but also some, some fear. And as someone who's in communica in the communication space, there's definitely. In that world, some fear that generative AI will take o take over. Um, that, that kind of work. And I know you're using generative a AI a lot. We've had some great conversations about it. And I'm curious, where, how does that feel to you right now, um, being someone who's interested in the technology, curious about it, and also probab, probably aware with the theme of what you've shared so far that. There's some, I don't know, some, maybe some fear or some anxiety if, do you have some fear and anxiety? I don't know. Uh, I'm getting off, off topic on my question.
Celia Jones: No, I like that. And I think this is, I think it's a common theme, especially, especially in intergenerational. Life, and I, I, I say intergenerational and I think that's a ministry term. I don't know if you would consider that a term outside of ministry, but I feel like for a long time in my work, I was at a church. And the way that looks is you have, uh. A large population in the church of senior adults who are perfectly happy with their communications being on paper. They've been sort of for they, at the time anyway, they had been, felt like they've been forced into the age of cell phones and, and you have early adapters in that demographic of, of course, and especially now, I think senior adults are savvy and they're all on Facebook, so. That's great. But um, and then you have, but you also have a younger generation. And so, you know, in my work, in the church particularly, it was sort of saying, okay, we can't run fully, we can't operate all online. We can't be fully on an app yet. But how do you hold that tension? And say, yes, I understand why you're hesitant about change. Uh, what would it look like to walk you into a space where you have the option? And a lot of times you're just holding a tension, right? So a long time, for a long time we were printing paper resources for these folks. But then Covid sort of created this moment where, you know, the QR, everybody can use a QR code Now, you know, and knows and understands it. But prior to. Prior to that, like it was a mixed bag of people didn't wanna use it 'cause they didn't have to. Right. So I think I've always sort of existed in that tension of, yes, I would love to run quickly down this path of tech. However, you can only go at the speed that the people you're communicating with go. Right. So I think I'm not unfamiliar with attention and I think when it comes to AI. It's still, you know, I think it depends on who you ask, right? I think some people would wear it as a badge of honor that they've never used Chat GPT. And then, then there's people that, uh, like me, I'm like, oh, I, I can't imagine my role without leveraging it in the proper spaces. You, you know, there's obvious ethical boundaries that you honor, but, um, yeah, it's, it's a mixed bag. So I don't know if I'm That's answering your question, but I think. For me, you're only as effective as the channel, as the how healthy your channel is, right? Mm-hmm. So for me, I'm leveraging AI, uh, and it's making my job immensely easier because I can understand the demographics that I wanna communicate to. I can, I can access psychology to understand who, who I wanna speak to and, and what they're, you know, it's just. It just makes everything easier to me. So I think it's, you know, you wanna honor the people who are anxious and say, how can we move towards progress in a way that isn't, that you don't wanna stagnate, but you still wanna like encourage so that the people who are far ahead feel, feel honored too. So yeah, I feel like I'm always in a problem solving. Mode of saying, okay, this is, I'm reading the room. Everyone's anxious, or not everybody, but for different reasons. So how do I respond to that and help us find a meaningful path forward, basically. Yeah.
Lydia Kumar: Thanks for sharing that. I, I'm curious about your journey, like your journey and how you started using the technology. It sounds, I think you, you shared some real nuance about na, how you are using. How you're using it in some very effective ways. You talked about sort of segmenting your market and understanding your population psychology, and I know you've transitioned from working in church-based organizations to working in a nonprofit that's. Focused on, uh, SE adult living, senior adult living and care. And so that's a transition. And I know AI is something that you have used to support you in this role transition. And so I'd curious about how that journey has looked. How did you start using the technology? What have you learned along the way, and what would you recommend for folks who are interested in starting exploring generative AI themselves?
Celia Jones: Yeah, I think, and I don't, you could probably speak to this more clearly than I could. I don't know if it's because I was so embedded in ministry in a context prior to my job switch. I changed, I've been in my current role for about six months. So in late 2024, I essentially switched industries. Uh, while where I work currently is, is faith-based. Uh, it is not, uh. It just, it's not structured in any way. You know, I went from an organization of, uh, with 15 employees to, uh, current, my current organization, we serve 1400 senior adults and we employ, or almost 1100 team members. So it's a very different structure and it's a healthcare. Forward industry. And so I don't know if, I don't know if AI just hadn't come to my awareness until then, or if it's, or if also it's sort of aligned with sort of a collective consciousness. Like everyone, it just feels like everyone's talking about it. And I don't know if I just wasn't paying attention before, or I just found myself in a space where, oh, I'm a newcomer. Like, I don't know. There's a lot here. I don't know. The learning gap is so large and. There are so many opportunities in senior living. Uh, and so it's just a very large industry. I think I read something the other day that 10,000 boomers. Turned 65, like, and I don't know, I should, I can't say a stat. I don't know if it's every year, but it's a lot. So it's not going away. So to me I was like, oh, there's a lot here I need to learn. And the quickest way to leverage that for me was AI. I mean, I think one of the first projects I used Chat GPT for is um. When I was applying for my current job as communications manager, I quickly realized, I was like, I'm moving from a generalist to, I'll be a part of a team, which has been great, but that means that I'm gonna have to go deeper into the specific areas of my job that I haven't had time to in the past. So I, I think the first project I used it for was I put in my job description, I put in my resume. I just asked Chad to be like, what are your thoughts? What do you think? And, you know, that's my first prompt, like, how do you feel about this? Uh, of course using very human, like what are, what are the vibes language? But, but I helped it, it helped me, it generated interview questions. It said, these are some gaps that we're seeing that where you, where we think you should ask. You know, for me, I always want to go in with clear expectations. Hey, I don't, I don't know this, is that okay? You know? Um. So that was like one of the first projects that I used it for. And then, um, after that, you know, like I said, I really leveraged it to my benefit to. Like, advance my knowledge in ways that I would just have had to read and suss through Google and hope for the best. You know, I, I think I use it pri a lot for compiling research. Like, like we mentioned earlier, um, I've always done mini, like I've done minimal PR throughout my life. Um, but this job specifically is heavily. Heavily has a heavy focus on public relations. Well, the last time I, I mean, I had a good foundation from college in public relations. Shout out our professor Mimi Merrit. But, but you know that, that a lot has changed in the industry in 10 years, and I had not, I did not have my finger on that pulse. So even just something like asking, asking what the common practices are, is this still what's, what's, what does this look like? You know, how, like what are the main, who are the main industries? How do I find contacts at newspapers and, and online magazines and stuff that I to, like to network with. So it's been a huge help with me with social media. You know, I do a lot of work in LinkedIn now, so I don't, I, I had never written for LinkedIn, so I was like, what does that, what's different? You know? So just. It, I've been able to just bring my curiosity to AI and it's been able to sort of say, here's, here's what you need to know, kind of. Yeah. I can't even remember the question. I've been yapping for so long, but,
Lydia Kumar: No, that's great. I think you, you shared so much about different ways that you've been using it and your journey and, and what that's looked like , is there anything that surprised you about how it works or how you interact with it?
Celia Jones: Yeah, and I think you and I have talked about this just casually, but I think it's helped me, uh, it's helped me become a better thinker, if that makes sense. Mm-hmm. So I think AI works so well when you give it clear. Prompts and instructions. Right. So I, I mentioned my first, my first prompt was like, what do you think about this? Okay. Well, I've come a long way in my ability to prompt it, because now I can look at it and say like, like, analyze this as someone, as a recruiter, you know, I can, I can give it, I can give it clearer instructions and I'm still learning. But I do think it's helped me think, and as a result, it's helped me. Right. You know, because I think writing is ultimately just the, being able to construct a thought and I can put in something, I can put something into AI if I'm writing it and it will feed me back. It sort of serves as a mirror. Sometimes I think it's like, because I think I come to AI or humans or we come to into the world. Layered in emotion anxiety, as I've already mentioned. You know, there's so much that we bring and AI can sort of serve as this mirror to what we bring to it to say, okay, this is what I'm getting from this, and then I'm able to, with that feedback, say, that's not what I want it to say at all. Or, you know, I, I like this about that, but I don't, but I need to. But I need to improve on, on how I'm thinking and how I'm, how I'm trying to express what I wanna say. So I think, yeah, I think it's made me a better thinker and in conversation now I work in a, in a team. I didn't used to, I used to sort of manage all the communications and it was all happening inside my head. But now that I get to collaborate with others on my team, I do think AI has helped me. Be able to articulate questions and it's developed my perspective, if that makes sense. Like I think it's, you know, now I'm cur like, it's helped me be able to articulate what I, what I want from others when I'm asking them questions.
Lydia Kumar: I think, yeah, I've found AI to be so helpful as a thought partner before the conversation that I might have with a team or with an individual that I work with to be able to say, okay, this is what I wanna get across. And. How does that land, or how could I word this in a different way based on this context? And so I don't know if that's exactly what you're talking about, Celia, but I, I feel like that I connected with that, um, ability to think about how I can communicate what I wanna communicate before I do it, to effectively work with, work with people.
Celia Jones: I think it's just so helpful to have an analytical. A computer partner basically, that I can run my thoughts through and it can, it can sort of, you know, it's like having an assistant, but the assistant also has this vast well of, of knowledge that it can access and it knows you really well. Like several times throughout my. My job. I think starting any new job can be nerve wracking, but I really struggle with imposter syndrome and so for me to be able to say, okay, based on all these questions that I've asked you for five months, I. Do you have advice for me and like considering, considering the ways, the things that I ask you and it's given me such good feedback. Like often it's, so, it's, it's very encouraging, but, uh, and I think, you know, you can only, you shouldn't take it as like. You need to take it with a grain of salt, like it'll hype you up to the level at which you need to be hyped. So there's that. But um, but yeah, I think in many ways it's saying the work that I'm doing, a lot of the work that I'm doing, especially internal communications, trying to communicate to 1100 people at various levels and involvement in our organization, there's a lot of psychology in that. And, um, I. Being able to use it as a processor, a partner to process that and think through that. Organizational psychology basically has been so helpful. And I'm, I'm just navigating all this in a different way 'cause I have someone, or something I should say, that I have a, an AI partner to sort of. Run this by, and I don't have to annoy my boss with 75 questions. Instead I can just ask my buddy. AI.
Lydia Kumar: It's very helpful when starting a new job to have a tool that you can, you can work alongside of because you's something a little embarrassing or hard about not having any idea what's going on. And I think generative AI has, has reduced that. It allows you to. I've been thinking a lot about how when you, because of generative AI, you do not have to be wrong as often or as vulnerable when you're not ready to be vulnerable because you can communicate with this, this, uh, tool before you have the conversation. And when I feel like you've experienced some of that in this job that is new and you just said you don't have to annoy your boss and that, that feels good and. Uh, for me, sometimes I wonder about the impact that has on us as people. If rather than, you know, being vulnerable or asking the question, we can always ask our generative AI thought partner and then come to the conversation with a different baseline. Do you see that ability to show up prepped with your, with your AI thought partner as a. As positive, negative, complicated. Have you thought about that?
Celia Jones: Yeah. I think for the record, my boss would say that I don't annoy him, but I do think it does position me in a way, like you said, to be able to come to him, come to him in a meeting and say, okay, these are things that I'm thinking about. It just helps me flesh out ideas more so that I'm not fully driving with my emotions. 'cause I think I'll, I'll put something into AI and, and quite frankly, like, it gave me feedback that was like, you're overthinking this. Like, I, I asked for the feedback. I wasn't just like, girl chill. But, um, it does sort of take away a little bit, you know, of the. I don't think it takes away the full vulnerability. I think you still have to show up. You still have to have real conversations and hard conversation. There's natural tension and work. Um, I do however, think it can help you, um, show up in the way that you. Want to, you know, like I think it can help you remove some of this, like this for me is it's the baggage of. Uh, a fear and anxiety, and it helps me sort of refine my thoughts and my ideas and feel more confident in them. And I would also argue that that's a lot of societal stuff that I have picked up after 34 years of being a woman in a male dominated field. You know? So what does it look like to offer myself the advantage of. The confidence of a mediocre white man, so to speak.
Lydia Kumar: I think that's, that's really interesting about leveling the playing field. I. Between like if you're using an AI tool and you're using it effectively, how that can maybe change the change where, how people show up in their roles, depending on who they are and the access someone has. If you can use an AI tool effectively, you can. You can communicate more effectively with those around you. 'Cause you have someone to think through something with ahead of time. You can do research quickly so that the information that you have is more accurate and just show up more ready to do the work that you need to do. And it's, you know, I, I really appreciate you too, sharing about your experience being a woman and a male dominated in industry and how I, I think that does wear on people over time if you are the outlier in your organization. Um, that can make it more challenging sometimes to get your point across or to have a person you can safely talk to. I think about this with AI sometimes is there are things at work that I would never say to people that I work with, but who am I supposed to talk to about those things with and having, being able to use. A generative AI tool to say, this is the situation I have no idea what to do. Um, help me think through, how do I word this email? How do I plan this agenda? How do I show up to this meeting in a way that's going to move us forward when I feel emotional? Not putting my emotions aside, but not let my emotion hinder the purpose of why I'm showing up in the first place.
Celia Jones: Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's, it's just been so, it's been really interesting and again, I didn't really mean for this to be so focused on my mental health, but it's out, I dunno. I think it's been such a nice place to process things. And like you said, get feedback and it's not always, I don't, I don't know that I always act out what AI tells me or their recommendations. Sometimes the, sometimes the act of putting it in and processing it makes me feel it does the work that previously I think my anxiety would've made where my previously, my anxiety would've made me over function in a system.
Lydia Kumar: Yeah, because you can actually, you know, type something in and it generates so quickly like, okay, you could do this, you could do this, you could do this. It's really easy to say, I don't wanna do that, I don't wanna do that. That's too much work. That won't land well. Mm-hmm. Um, I already actually know what to do in this situation. So, yeah. That's, that's really interesting to think about. AI. Uh. It goes so fast, it can do all of your anxiety thinking before you have, before you've been able to do it. It processes so quickly.
Celia Jones: I know it's, it's wild. I think that was one of the things that surprised me the most about it. But like that it's just so quick. Like, I don't want this to end like this bus who's driving this bus kind of question. You know, it feels a little bit like the technology is getting smarter as time goes on. So who's who's, like I said, who's driving the bus? So there is that. Obviously that's a fear that I have and I wanna be mindful of. And also I think my faith. Informs the way that I think about the earth in stewardship of the Earth. And so there is a piece of me that I'm like, I don't need to bring every thought I have into this con because I do think, um, there is an environmental implication, right? And I don't, I don't know a lot about what AI, like the amount of processing, what that does to, um. Our energy grid and how, I don't, I don't know the environmental ram, we don't really know the ramifications of like how quickly this is growing and, and becoming a part of everyone's lives. But I do, I am curious to keep like an ear to the conversations to know like, what's a, what's a good way to steward this crazy technology? Without being wasteful, I don't have to bring everything to it. And I think it's like you said, well, I think I said earlier, um, it does help me, it has helped me sort of think in a more analytical way. And so it's like, how is this, how can I use this as like a mental gym? And then I'm a better thinker because I'm, because I'm so used to sort of sparring with this guy. How do I bring that into. And to practice in a way that isn't, that isn't using scary amounts of energy. So that's just something that I think about. Also, I think you asked,
Lydia Kumar: Discernment feels like it plays into this of, you know, when do you use the tool? When do you not? And I'm wondering for you, have you found. Moments where you're like, okay, this is something that I actually don't need to go to AI with. I, I wanna talk to a person, or this is something that I wanna pray about instead of talking to AI about, or this is something that I just need to sit with before I get input from, from gen AI. How have you nav? Are you Navi? Do you, do you notice yourself making those choices or navigating that? I.
Celia Jones: Yeah, I think especially at this job, I've found myself actively wanting to be in the office for, if not five days a week. And I think a piece of that is the concept of human connection and learning a system that isn't. Like, like obviously my job has an organizational structure, but not all of our processes, you know, some of those processes are organic and nothing's gonna ever replace me. Just being able to live in a system and learn it, and I do feel like that is a very human I. Gift, this power of intuition and being able to read a room to help solve a problem and, and build relational capital, if that makes sense. So I do feel like there are certain parts of my job that feel relational and in a way spiritual because you're just building something with other people every day. And so there is a, there are aspects of my job that I feel like are. There are things that are happening under the surface. Right. And I think before I was on a team with other people, I don't know that I would've acknowledged that that's how I operate. But especially in this role, I think it's so helpful to be able to observe dynamics of the people around you. Build, build rapport, and like. Spend time with others to be able to understand how communications can make their jobs easier and how it can improve the way that the organization exists. And that's internal and external comms. So, um, I think that there's a piece of it that I was like, I'm never gonna be able to say that to the, to the robots because, because that's just something that's happening under the surface. And so again, that's a gift that anxiety has given me is like, I'm always reading the room because I think it's helpful, you know?
Lydia Kumar: I think you have a gift for being able to pick up on people's emotions and understand, you know, a lot of how we interact with humans. I, I don't notice the stat, but, you know, part of its tone, part of its body language and then very little is what you actually say. And I, I think you, you do have a gift of being able to. To see what people around you need. And I, I think about the kind of data that AI can draw from, and there's the qualitative data that you can write and you can write into, feed it a transcript of a conversation. But you can't, at least at this point, uh ha and maybe, maybe not ever give it all of the, the information that's happening around you on a day to day. And there's a feeling that people carry with them sometimes that you can't even. Explain that is just like being around someone. It's, you pick up that tone, that body language, the way people interact with each other and that gives you a lot of information that sometimes that I don't, I don't know if a robot will ever be able to do much with.
Celia Jones: Yeah. And I think that they pro, they probably will be able to analyze a lot of this. And I do think as far as the way that communications happens. If they'll be able to help, they'll, they'll just make communicators better. And then I think the way that communicators figure out how it helps them, the way to leverage it, is still up to the humans, right? Like we still have to say, we still have to bring it. The things that we are assessing that our organizations and our lives need, right? Like I have to be vulnerable enough to bring in a problem. That is nuanced and has layers and I've thought about and worried about, or again, I really don't even think I have that much anxiety, but it's just coming up a lot in our conversation. But yeah, like, you know, I think, um, AI is so good because it's leveraging all of our, it's, it's leveraging all of our past, all of the things that we've created, right? So it's just. It's just intensifying the human experience for us a little bit. And it's never gonna, I don't think it'll ever replace that human creativity, like the gym of an idea that I can bring it and then it makes a half baked cake, and then I finish baking the cake. Um, so I think it's a, like I said, I, I see it as a partner. A partner with humanity.
Lydia Kumar: I feel like that's very encouraging because there may be people listening to this podcast or, or folks in general who worry about, you know, job replacement. And I think throughout this conversation you have continually shown the value add of the human and how. It's not a replacement, it's a, it's, it's additive. I think about, you know, whenever there's been a big technological innovation like the Industrial Revolution or the age of computing, there's always been adjustments to how we work, and I think we're in a major adjustment in how we work. And you're. You've given us a lot of good examples of how people in the communication, the Communicator roles, can use this technology to enhance what they do rather than have themselves be replaced. And that's in, I think that's very hopeful.
Celia Jones: I hope so. And I'm also, you know, for better or for worse, an idealist. So, but I do find that in my work, even with something as simple as AI. I mean, sorry, this is all AI. Even with something as simple as social media, what's good about what it creates? If I don't bring it this little nugget of a, of an angle or a concept, it's gonna create something that feels to me a lot like I do feel like in some writing you can tell now, but I think it'll AI, it's weird 'cause AI will get better, right? But then ideally humans will also say, okay, but what's human about this, this story and this, this connection that we've, that I've experienced? And how do I offer that new, that new thing that makes this story special? Um. I feel like it takes just as much faith to be a cynic or to be a, to be po. I think it may, it might take more faith to be a hopeful and I idealistic, but it's uh, you know, we just have to. You gotta pick. So I'm just, for now, I'm picking positive.
Lydia Kumar: If, for people who may be very early in their AI journey and they're thinking about, okay, how do I approach this? How do I use this technology? What would be your advice to, for partnership with an AI tool?
Celia Jones: Yeah. I think to me. A really easy, easy point of access is, is viewing it as a search engine, you know, and I am always very, very impressed with not only what it gives me when I ask it a question, but then the way it's cited. And you know, you can, you can always dig for proof after you search for something, but I think it's just. I, I have not found a way to search and gather in information at the speed and the accuracy and the breadth at which it can do that. So I think that's an easy way to say, just, just use it as a search engine, and see what you think, you know, if you don't like it, if you prefer to hunt through Google, that is an option for you, I think. And Google would probably appreciate it. So Google, even Google, they have a Gemini now, so. Um, everyone's leveraging it. It's just a matter of, uh, if you, and, you know, it's not perfect, it's gonna make mistakes, I think, but to me that feels like an easy point of access to say, let me try using this instead.
Lydia Kumar: Yeah. It's a, \ it can give you so much information so quickly and it's familiar. We all know how to type some words into Google and you can do something very similar and get, and do some, some quick research. Mm-hmm. My last question for you is, what is an idea or question about AI that you cannot stop thinking about right now?
Celia Jones: Yeah, I think we've touched on this in this conversation. Probably in previous conversations about AI, but I think I'm often wondering how can AI help make us more human? So the, the work that I'm doing, particularly when I'm thinking about internal communications, I'm looking for ways within our organization to break down barriers, to build trust to. Help people help provide visibility to people at all access points of our organization as a communicator. And that's difficult 'cause there's a lot of, there's a lot of challenges inherently in communications, but how can, how can AI help solve these, these very human problems that. Day to day, there may feel like there's a lot of separation between us, between the levels of our organizations, the distances, our roles at these organizations. But ultimately, we're all just coming into work every day. We wanna do our best. We wanna, we wanna feel like we're, we're. We're earning what we're being paid and that we're contributing value to the organization. And so how can AI help us show up in those, in whatever context we're in? Whether it's your work mine, how can it make us better people and break down some of these barriers that tend to. Tend to exist simply because, you know, no communications channel is perfect. No human is perfect. So what are ways that we can use it to build trust, build relationships between others, because we're communicating better. Mm-hmm. We're, we're doing a better job of expressing our thoughts and our ideas and what we want from others and what, you know, how we can help them. Uh, I'm always asking it, I'm always asking AI, you know. How can I make this clearer? How can I, you know, what, what are your thoughts about this, this, um, this concept or this paragraph? You know, so how can it make us more human, right? Like more essential, like the things, the work that we're doing, the value we're adding, how can it make it more, more efficient and effective?
Lydia Kumar: I love that. Um, it makes me think about how loneliness was, is like a national epidemic. The surgeon, the US Surgeon General, uh, released, I don't know, like a year ago that loneliness was a national epidemic and it comes with all of these health, health risks. And I think there's one, one maybe pessimistic way to look at AI that it'll make us more separate and we'll all just be talking to robots all day. But I think there's another. Another way to look at this, that AI helps us communicate better. It helps us reorient our time so that we're spending less time doing these, uh, admin repetitive tasks and more time connecting and having meaningful conversations and doing work that's meaningful. And, um, I, I hope that's where we end up.
Celia Jones: Me too. I'm excited for where this takes us I still wanna be friends with the robots just in case. So I'm, this is all me positioning myself positively.
Lydia Kumar: Oh, you're, you're really setting yourself up for successful. They're gonna, the, the robots are gonna be like, this girl was on our team the whole time.
Celia Jones: Well, it really does sound like I'm like singing their praises. Um. I kind of am. I think that you have to be, again, you wanna be, we wanna be like cautiously optimistic, I think.
Lydia Kumar: I think it's a good way to be. We can, we can be afraid and paralyzed or we can understand what's, do our best to understand what's happening and how we move through that. And that's, I think, a gift that we can give to ourselves and other people.
Lydia Kumar: What a wonderfully open and insightful conversation with my good friend Celia Jones. I really appreciate her vulnerability in sharing that blend of curiosity and anxiety that so many of us feel, and not just about AI, but about navigating change in general. It was fascinating to hear how she transformed the apprehension into action using AI tools as practical partners to learn a new industry, but also. More profoundly as a thought partner to sharpen her own thinking, build confidence, and even manage feelings of imposter syndrome. Her hopeful perspective on AI as a tool that used intentionally can actually help make us more human by fostering better communication and connection is such a core Ken Wise idea.
Lydia Kumar: A huge thank you to Celia Jones for sharing her thoughtful journey of integrating AI with such heart and intention in her communications work. Next time on Kinwise Conversations, we'll be shifting gears to exploring how AI is impacting larger organizational systems in the future of work. As I chat with Travis Packer, a consultant helping companies navigate these changes, you won't wanna miss his insights on leadership in this new era.
I hope this discussion has encouraged you wherever you are on your own AI path. If you enjoyed this conversation, please subscribe and consider leaving a review. It truly helps other thoughtful listeners find us. You can learn more about how to approach AI with intention, explore resources, and join the Kin Wise collective by visiting kinwise.org. And if you or someone you know is doing interesting work at the intersection of AI and humanity and has a story to share, we'd love to hear from you. Until next time, stay curious, stay grounded, and stay Kinwise.
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5 Prompts to Use AI as a Thought Partner
Inspired by Celia Jones’ episode of Kinwise Conversations
Tip before you begin:
AI works best when you bring your specific context into the conversation. Before asking your question, briefly explain your role, audience, or goal. Think of it like asking a colleague for advice. They’ll help more if they know where you're coming from.1. Navigating a New Role
“I just started a new job as a [communications manager in senior living]. I’m learning a whole new industry. Can you help me identify what I need to learn and how AI might support that process?”
2. Building Confidence for a Conversation
“I’m preparing for an important meeting and I sometimes feel unsure in my new role as a [communications lead]. Here’s my job description and background. Can you help me prep or reflect on what I bring to the table?”
3. Communicating Across Generations
“I’m writing a message for a mixed-age audience. Some are older adults who prefer printed newsletters, others are younger and digital-first. Can you help me draft something that works for both groups?”
4. Using AI to Strengthen Human Connection
“In my job as an internal communicator, I want to use AI to strengthen human connection. Can you suggest ways to use AI to build trust, clarity, and belonging in our organization?”
5. Knowing When to Use AI vs. Not
“Sometimes I’m not sure when to use AI and when to talk to a person or sit with a question myself. Can you help me think through what kinds of tasks or questions are better for AI vs. human relationships?”
